Iran has been in a state of emergency since the violent death of Jîna Mahsa Amini. ntv.de talks to the human rights activist Düzen Tekkal about why the protests are different this time, it’s not just about hair or the headscarf and why the Iranian women urgently need our support.
ntv.de: The pictures of the protests in Iran are currently going around the world. Are we getting to see everything that’s going on in the country at the moment?
Düzen Tekkal: No, unfortunately not. We only get to see a tenth. Iran throttles the internet to prevent these images. The most important things people have on the streets right now are their cell phones. The regime understood that too, which is why mobile phones are confiscated, and people are beaten or even killed because they have recorded mobile phone videos. The government knows this is the greatest weapon that can be used against them. The revolution is in full swing. I get videos from western Iran at night where people are standing in the street, cheering and singing. On the other hand, we also see many seriously injured and dead. I wonder when it will arrive that this is a really big momentum.
What do you see that people outside of Iran don’t see?
I get a lot of pictures and videos showing the seriously injured. When I report, I refrain from showing them all because they are very gruesome pictures. It’s always a matter of balancing what I publish and what not. But every video that reaches me is linked to the deep wish of those affected: “Please share these videos and show the world what is happening here. We need you, you are our sound amplifier and we rely on you because we have no other Choice.”
There have been uprisings against the regime before. Nevertheless, one often hears and reads that this time the government will be overthrown. What is different about the current protests?
It is cross-generational, cross-class, cross-racial and cross-religious. It’s as if everyone had agreed. Although you can’t plan anything because the internet is throttled, it seems that way because everyone is united by the thought: down with this regime, away with the dictator. We’re ready to die, but we won’t go on like this anymore. We also notice this in the pictures from Saqqez, the birthplace of Jîna Mahsa Amini, or from Kurdistan in general, in western Iran. Suddenly the Iranians also feel responsible there. This is no longer a matter for the Kurds or the minorities. It’s everyone’s business.
What’s special this time?
When Amini was killed, a minority within the minority was killed: a Sunni, a Kurd, a woman. And all of Iran says: “We are Jîna Mahsa Amini.” Children and teenagers are killed just for going to protests. Everyone sees the injustice. The regime wants to prevent these images.
Human rights organizations have so far counted more than 180 dead in the demonstrations. Do you think the Iranian government will ever stop using violence?
No, on the contrary, they are becoming more and more brutal. That’s what we’re hearing from western Iran, where new forces have emerged who don’t even speak Persian. That means the regime has called for help. They don’t know what to do other than hit back brutally because they have nothing else. One must not forget that for both sides it is only going in one direction. The one who slacks off is finished. People feel this with full brutality. Children are being killed, teachers who are caring for their students are being arrested, doctors who are trying to help the injured are being taken away. They even stand in front of the pharmacies so that their own population cannot be doctored.
How long do you think the protests in Iran will last?
For a long time. The protesters will not stop and are willing to sacrifice and die. Because what they are fighting for is bigger than themselves. But how long also depends on us here in Europe and the liberal West. What the people of Iran want is that we look and that we act. They want us to see the regime for what it is – an unjust regime. They don’t understand why nuclear negotiations are still going on with Iran. People feel like they’re being stabbed in the back.
Foreign Minister Annalena Baerbock says she stands for a feminist foreign policy. Do you think she is doing enough for women in Iran?
It’s a start, but not enough. We had the opportunity to speak to her…
… live on the social network Instagram.
Exactly, with our aid organization HÁWAR.help we brought together Iranians and Mrs. Baerbock. I think that shows where she stands. This is more than symbolic politics. In addition to the Instagram Live, there were also several hours of behind-the-scenes talks where Iranian voices had the opportunity to really unpack. We experienced a foreign minister who listened. Nonetheless, that is of course not enough. It is now a matter of doing justice to the claim of a feminist foreign policy.
What does that mean?
The women in Iran show us what feminism means. They show what it means to be determined by others. It is the headscarf, but not just the headscarf. It is much more than that. It is the Islamic penal code that has deprived them of life. You have to consider what women have been through in the last 43 years since this regime has been in power. That’s why women are leading this revolution. It is an emancipatory struggle for liberation. This is feminism.
A lot of men also take to the streets and demonstrate for women’s rights. Did that surprise you? That didn’t surprise me. I think that surprised the West, because we have our clichés in mind of the chauvinistic man from the Orient who oppresses his wife. But that’s not the whole picture, on the contrary. The women lead this revolution to the frenetic applause of the men. These men are fathers, sons and brothers and have also suffered under this injustice regime when their mothers and daughters have been snatched from the cars. They know and say that there is no freedom without respect for women’s rights and equality.
Do the protests only have something to do with state repression or also with Islam?
It’s all built on an Islamist principle. State and religion are inseparable in Iran. The mullahs (Islamic legal and religious scholars, editor’s note) basically used religion to set up a repressive parade and take the majority of the population hostage. They use religion against their own people. But to be clear: it’s Muslims who are taking to the streets and standing up for their basic rights. Now to claim that they are Islamophobic is insane. Unfortunately, that is also part of the problem of how we in Europe look at these topics. We have to rethink that.
What do we have to do about it?
Of course we have to question the Islamist structures that represent these regimes. It is about distinguishing and deriving preventive measures that prevent a society from being oppressed. We must remove this basis from the unjust regime. Politics is made with religion. That is the difference.
Women around the world show their solidarity with the protesters in Iran and cut their hair. What does this gesture mean and what does it do?
Cutting your hair is an act of deep sadness. I grew up with it. Jîna Mahsa Amini was Kurdish, that’s very important. Our funerals are public and noisy. Lamentations are sung and shouted. As a sign of mourning, women then cut off their sacred hair and braids and put them in the grave. When a woman cuts her hair, she says: my hair, my body, my life. My expression of sadness, my struggle for liberation. It’s something very intimate, that’s why it touches us so much. It is a silent but very solidary act of mourning.
Does it help women in Iran if women in the rest of the world imitate them?
It provides some visibility. It says “we see you and your pain”. But there are many ways to express solidarity. It is important that it comes from the heart.
Some activists from Iran have also criticized the solidarity cutting of the hair.
Right. But what I hear most often from the women concerned in Iran is that they are much more pragmatic than we are. While we are discussing here what is allowed and not allowed, they say: Anything that helps us.
Vivian Micks spoke to Düzen Tekkal
